Re: New page with current Black Projects at Groom

Message posted by Richard on March 16, 2002 at 17:50:45 PST:

F117, good post.

I have a few things here that 'niggle' me on these programmes.
First of all, Andreas spotted the black programme aircraft at Area 51 in pure daylight, fully visible with no attempt to mask it whatsoever.
Yet, so far, with the 'hordes' of people who spend their time up that mountain looking at the base all day and night, seem to see nothing at all.
Are these programmes only visible to Mainland European viewers who come all that way of 'hoping 'to see something and not go home disappointed? So far from what i have seen, it has 'only' been mostly these sort of visitors and not the ones who spend days and days each year trying to view something 'other than a janet' at the base.

The residents around the area also speculate they have seen many flights of these aircraft flying at daytime, yet still no photographic proof. It just seems strange that no one wants to pick up a camera these days when something just as strange is flying overhead.

So far the only 'black' things people take photos of in this area are B-2 Spirits, former black programmes.

I have heard of no one else seeing this particular aircraft sitting on the ramps at Groom that Andreas photographed, so why only 'show the' plane once, why show it at all knowing people are watching anyway? WHY is it that no one else seems to have spotted this before at the base? Or have any of you?
Why go to such an expense to hide programmes, at a facility where hardly anyone can see operations, and then fly the aircraft over populated areas in pure daylight...?
So far, from the 'many' sightings spotted in and around groom lake, we have not had 'much evidence' at all that these did take place.
For some reason, people just dont photograph these strange looking aircraft taxi-ing, flying etc overhead but just tell the story in writing.
I know its easy to pick up the bino's and forget about the camera, Ive done it myself but then, most people are out in that area to 'get a photo' of aircraft of this nature anyway, and still, not a peep of evidence of any of these programmes exists on photographic proof... albeit but a few which are generally so bad in quality or too far away we can see no detail or most of the time differentiate between a black prgramme or standard military aircraft.
There must be someone out there who has better quality photos of these programmes, apparently flying around during the daytime.

Also, the photo of the aircraft taken in black and white on that page does not show that aircraft in particular being a black programme. We have no proof again of where this photo was taken.
It some respects, apart from the extended rear of the aircraft it could be mistaken for an Delta Dart Target drone off the Californian coast. As the photo again was taken so far away from the photographer, we see yet again, very bad quality, showing no details whatsoever of any features recogniseable from a normal delta wing aircraft, apart from the extended nozzle area.

Perhaps we should just ask Skunkworks when they are next flying their black programmes, and where, they seem to fly them in daylight quite often, perhaps even they might give you a proper photo as a present as no one so far has come up with any respectable of any aircraft looking other than standard.

F-117 also points out, so far, everyone seems be talking about Lockheed projects, and we know for a fact Northrop are out there digging their heals in various programmes, amongst other companies.

It does amaze me that over all these years of people viewing the base complex and wandering around the ranges that no one so far has ever come up with any photo that just 'amazes' us.
From the photos so far, i have not really seen anything that is of 'great' amazement or interest, mainly because of the quality of the photos... perhaps one day, someone somewhere, after spending several years acummulated up and around that mountain might finally get a good photo. I hope i am one of those people when i finally get out there again.

Perhaps i am just too sceptical on some of these discussions lately... theres some info passed around here lately that just does not add up at all... and it seems other people have noticed this as well.
I dont mind being flamed for my posts, go ahead, but so far, from 'some' of the posts regarding people in the know, they havent really come up with any proof that shows us details of what these aircraft are.

The Mig29 photo turned out to be a Swedish AF photo, similar in quality to the many Mig25 images we have seen, also taken by the Swedish AF.
Now, for some reason yet again, we have another poor quality black and white photo released, again with no details.
And horizon to horizon in 10 seconds.... well just explain that to me...perhaps i am too thick to understand.
Horizon to Horizon, what altitude, approximately did this aircraft operate at the time?
When you say horizon to horizon, do you mean, from when you first viewed the aircraft until you lost contact with it? Or do you mean for example there were mountains also in the picture...

I know the space shuttle and ISS are extremely high up, but they travel at around 17500mph and they take much longer to go from horizon to horizon in 10 secs... atleast in my field of view anyway. Maybe the height difference is the key, if you can establish the approximate altitude then possibly i could believe a 10 sec sprint...but at the moment, i dont.

Any good info appreciated, but at the moment i am just too scepticle on some of these posts lately... i'd love to be proven wrong, as i usually am, thats no problem, just some decent answers from decent people who know what they know and perhaps with some peroper evidence.


In Reply to: New page with current Black Projects at Groom posted by Joerg (Webmaster) on March 16, 2002 at 12:40:38 PST:


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