Lazar's Story - Technical tidbits
by Tom Mahood

The Word of Bob

Over time, I've become very interested in the Lazar story, particularly from a technical viewpoint. Unfortunately, few of the interviews or statements he's given went very far into technical areas. What I have done is assemble all info I could find regarding Lazar's statements specifically on how the gravity drive operates, and to a lesser extent, how the crafts move through space (Please feel free to add "allegedly" and "supposedly" wherever you'd like!). I was looking for the overall picture, and also for contradictions in his story. Judge for yourselves.

NOTE: Some of the interviews were simply question and answer sessions. In those cases, I took liberties of excerpting only pertinent questions and strung them together in the order asked and answered. In the case of the book and tape excerpts, there existed a certain flow, so I identified discontinuities by the notation [BREAK].

Tom Mahood (
February 28, 1994

On the Record, KLAS-TV, Las Vegas, Nevada, 12/9/89

George Knapp, producer/host

Robert Lazar, guest

Lazar: The first thing was HANDS-on experience with the anti-matter reactor.

Knapp: Explain what that is and how it works and what it does.

Lazar: It's a plate about 18 inches in diameter with a sphere on top.

Knapp: We have a tape of a model that a friend of yours made. You can narrate along. There it is.

Lazar: Inside that tower is a chip of Element 115 they just put in there. That's a super-heavy element. The lid goes on top. And as far as any other of the workings of it, I really don't know, you know, [such as] what's inside the bottom of it . . .115 sets up a gravitational field around the top. That little wave guide you saw being put on the top: it essentially siphons off the gravity wave, and that's later amplified in the lower portion of the craft. But just in general, the whole technology is virtually unknown.

Knapp: Now we saw the model. We saw the pictures of it there. It looks really, really simple, almost too simple to actually do anything.

Lazar: Right.

Knapp: Working parts?

Lazar: None detectable. Essentially, what the job was to back-engineer everything, where you have a finished product and to step backwards and find out how it was made or how it could be made with earthly materials. There hasn't been very much progress.

Knapp: How long do you think they've had this technology up there?

Lazar: It seems like quite a while, but I really don't know.

Knapp: What could you do with an anti-matter generator? What does it do?

Lazar: It converts anti-matter . . .It DOESN'T convert anti-matter! There's an annihilation reaction. It's an extremely powerful reaction, a hundred percent conversion of matter to energy, unlike a fission or fusion reaction which is somewhere around eight-tenths of one percent conversion of matter to energy.

Knapp: How does it work? What starts the reaction going?

Lazar: Really, once the 115 is put in, the reaction is initiated.

Knapp: Automatic.

Lazar: Right.

Knapp: I don't understand. I mean, there's no button to push or anything?

Lazar: No, there's no button to push or anything. Apparently, the 115 under bombardment with protons lets out an anti-matter particle. This anti-matter particle will react with any matter whatsoever, which I imagine there is some target system inside the reactor. This, in turn, releases heat, and somewhere within that system there is a one-hundred-percent-efficient thermionic generator, essentially a heat-to-electrical generator.

Knapp: How is this anti-matter reactor connected to gravity generation that you were talking about earlier?

Lazar: Well, that reactor serves two purposes; it provides a tremendous amount of electrical power, which is almost a by-product. The gravitational wave gets formed at the sphere, and that's through some action of the 115, and the exact action I don't think anyone really knows. The wave guide siphons off that gravity wave, and that's channeled above the top of the disk to the lower part where there are three gravity amplifiers, which amplify and direct that gravity wave.

Knapp: In essence creating their own gravitational field.

Lazar: Their own gravitational field.

Knapp: You're fairly convinced that science on earth doesn't have this technology right now? We have it now at S-4, I guess, but we didn't create it?

Lazar: Right.

Knapp: Why not? Why couldn't we?

Lazar: The technology's not even -- We don't even know what gravity IS!

Knapp: Well, what is it? What have you learned about what gravity is?

Lazar: Gravity is a wave. There are many different theories, wave included. It's been theorized that gravity is also particles, gravitons, which is also incorrect. But gravity is a wave. The basic wave they can actually tap off of an element: why that is I'm not exactly sure.

Knapp: So you can produce your own gravity. What does that mean? What does that allow you to do?

Lazar: It allows you to do virtually anything. Gravity distorts time and space. By doing that, now you're into a different mode of travel, where instead of traveling in a linear method -- going from Point A to B -- now you can distort time and space to where you essentially bring the mountain to Mohammed; you almost bring your destination to you without moving.

And since you're distorting time, all this takes place in between moments of time. It's such a far-fetched concept!

Knapp: Of course, what the UFO skeptics say is, yeah, there's life out there elsewhere in the universe; it can never come here; it's just too darn far. With the kind of technology you're talking about, it makes such considerations irrelevant about distance and time and things like that.

Lazar: Exactly, because when you are distorting time, there's no longer a normal reference of time. And that's what producing your own gravity does.

Knapp: You can go forward or backward in time? Is that's what you're saying?

Lazar: No, not essentially. It would be easier with a model. On the bottom side of the disk are the three gravity generators. When they want to travel to a distant point, the disk turns on its side. The three gravity generators produce a gravitational beam. What they do is they converge the three gravity generators onto a point and use that as a focal point; and they bring them up to power and PULL that point towards the disk. The disk itself will attach ONTO that point and snap back -- AS THEY RELEASE SPACE BACK TO THAT POINT!

Now all this happens in the distortion of time, so time is not incrementing. So the SPEED is essentially infinite.

Knapp: We'll get into the disks in a moment. But the first time you saw the anti-matter reactor in operation or a demonstration -- you had a couple of demonstrations -- tell me about that.

Lazar: The first time I saw it in operation, we just put -- a friend I worked with, Barry -- put the fuel in the reactor, put the lid on as, as was shown there. Immediately, a gravitational field developed, and he said, "Feel it!" And it felt like you bring two like poles of a magnet together; you can do that with your hand. And it was FASCINATING to do that, impossible, except on something with great mass! And obviously this is just a . . .

And it was a REPULSION field. In fact, we kind of fooled around with it for a little while. And we threw golf balls off it. And it was just a really unique thing.

Knapp: And you had other demonstrations to show you that this is pretty wild stuff, right?

Lazar: Yeah, they did. They were able to channel the field off in a demonstration that they created an INTENSE gravitational area. And you began to see a small little black disk form, and that was the bending of the light.

Knapp: Just like a black hole floating around?

Lazar: Yeah, well, a black hole is a bad analogy, but yeah, essentially.

Thursday, December 28th 1989: KVEG Radio Interview

Caller: With the gravity generators running, is there thermal radiation?

Lazar: No, not at all. I was never down on the bottom WHILE the gravity generators were running, but the reactor itself -- there's no thermal radiation whatsoever. That was one of the really shocking things because that violates the first law of thermodynamics.

Lazar: In fact, I'm in the process of fabricating the gravity amplifier, but then I'm at a tremendous shortage for power. So yeah, I have even tried to do that stuff on my own.

Caller: Is there any electronics as we know it -- chips or transistors?

Lazar: No, nothing like that. Because of the tremendous power involved, too, there was no direct connection between the gravity amplifiers and the reactor itself.

Caller: Are the wave guides similar to what we use with microwaves?

Lazar: Very similar.

Caller: In regard to the long-range method of travel, isn't a propulsion unit the wrong idea? I feel this device is creating a situation where it is diminishing or removing the localized gravitational field, and long-distance body that they're heading toward is actually PULLING the vehicle rather than it being pushed. Am I correct in this?

Lazar: The vehicle is not being pushed. But being pulled implies it's being pulled by something externally: It's pulling something else to IT. IT's creating the gravitational field.

Caller: Is there any relation to the monopoles which [scientists] have been looking for?

Lazar: Well, they've been looking for the monopole magnet. But then this [the UFO force] is a gravitational force.

Caller: What is the top speed of the craft?

Lazar: It's tough to say a top speed because to say speed you have to compare distance and time. And when you're screwing around with time and distorting it, you can no longer judge a velocity. They're not traveling in a linear mode where they just fly and cover a certain distance in a certain time. That's the real definition of speed. They're bending and distorting space and then essentially snapping it back with the craft, so the distances they can travel are phenomenal -- in little or no time. So speed has little bearing.

Caller: You've mentioned anti-gravity generator and anti-matter generator. Are they different?

Lazar: It's not a gravity generator; it's a gravity amplifier. I Get tongue-twisted all too often. The anti-matter reactor provides the power for the craft and the basic low-amplitude gravitational wave, which is too low of an amplitude to do anything. It's piped into the gravity amplifiers, which are found at the bottom of the craft. There it's amplified into an extremely powerful wave, and that's what the craft is flown on. But there is an anti-matter reactor: that's what provides the power.

Caller: I understand there's an antenna section in this device; what is the resonant frequency that that operates at?

Lazar: The resonant frequency of the gravity wave I do know, but I don't know it off hand; I just can't remember it.

Mark: Can you give me a ballpark, like 2,000 kilohertz?

Lazar: I really don't remember. It's a really odd frequency.

Mark: Is it measured in kilohertz or gigahertz or megahertz?

Lazar: I really don't remember.

Burt: You were talking about the low- and high-speed modes and the control factors in there. Can you describe those modes and what the ship looks like each time it is going through those modes?

Lazar: The low-speed mode -- and I REALLY wish I could remember what they call these, but I can't, as I can't remember the frequency of the wave --The low-speed mode: The craft is very vulnerable; it bobs around. And it's sitting on a weak gravitational field, sitting on three gravity waves. And it just bounces around. And it can focus the waves behind it and keep falling forward and hobble around at low speed. The second mode: They increase the amplitude of the field, and the craft begins to lift, and it performs a ROLL maneuver: it begins to turn, roll, begins to turn over. As it begins to leave the earth's gravitational field, they point the bottom of the craft at the DESTINATION. This is the second mode of travel, where they converge the three gravity amplifiers -- FOCUS them -- on a point that they want to go to. Then they bring them up to full power, and this is where the tremendous time-space distortion takes place, and that whips them right to that point.

Burt: Did you actually bench-test a unit away from the craft itself?

Lazar: The reactor, yeah.

Burt: About how large is this, and could you describe it?

Lazar: The device itself is probably a plate about 18 inches square; I said diameter before but it is square. There's a half-sphere on top where the gravity wave is tapped off of, but that's about the size of it.

Jim from Las Vegas: On TV, you spoke of observing a demonstration of this anti-matter gravity wave controller device. And you made a mock-up copy?

Lazar: A friend made one, yeah.

Jim: I heard you speak of bouncing golf balls off of this anti-gravity field?

Lazar: Yeah.

Jim: And also about the candle, the wax, and the flame stood still?

Lazar: Right.

Jim: And then the hole that you saw appear --

Lazar: It wasn't a hole; it was a little disk.

Jim: Under what conditions did you see this demonstrated? Elaborate on this. And how large was the force field?

Lazar: The force field where the candle was?

Jim: The force field created by the anti-matter device.

Lazar: It was about a 20-inch radius from the surface of the sphere.

Jim: Where was this area, just above the device?

Lazar: Yeah, surrounding the sphere.

Jim: Did the sphere surround the device?

Lazar: No, the sphere sits in the center of the device. It's a half-sphere sitting on a plate, and a field surrounds the half-sphere.

Jim: And you just place a candle in there?

Lazar: No, no, no. That was a separate demonstration. I'm just telling you where the field EXTENDS from.

Jim: Oh, that's what I'm curious about.

Lazar: No, they tap the field off using a wave guide, off of the sphere. And this is a completely different setup, where they had a mockup small gravity amplifier, and there were three focused into a point, and that area of focus was probably nine or ten inches in diameter.

Jim: They displaced this area or moved this area?

Lazar: No, it wasn't displaced; it's just where the field was generated.

Jim: And in there you put the candle?

Lazar: Right.

Jim: And that thing can actually bounce golf balls off of it?

Lazar: No, no. The golf ball thing, again, had nothing to do with that setup. The golf ball thing had something to do with just when the reactor was energized, before the wave guide was put on or anything. We were just pushing on the field; it was being demonstrated to me; and we just bounced a golf ball off the top.

March, April 1990 (approximate time of interviews):

"Alien Contact" by Timothy Good. Published by William Morrow and Company in 1991 & 1993.

This book was also published under the title "Alien Liaison: The Ultimate Secret". Some of the Lazar info is a rehash of earlier interviews with Knapp and excerpts from his tape, however there is some new stuff and drawings by Lazar.

....The craft does not create an "antigravity" field, as some have surmised. "It's a gravitational field that's out of phase with the current one," Lazar explained in a 1989 radio interview. "It's the same gravitational wave. The phases vary from 180 degrees to a longitudinal propagation."


Assuming they're in space, they will focus the three gravity generators on the point they want to go to. Now, to give an analogy: If you take a thin rubber sheet, say, lay it on a table and put thumbtacks in each corner, then take a big stone and set it on one end of the rubber sheet and say that's your spacecraft, you pick out a point that you want to go to -which could be anywhere on the rubber sheet - pinch that point with your fingers and pull it all the way up to the craft. That's how it focuses and pulls that point to it. When you then shut off the gravity generator[s], the stone (or spacecraft) follows that stretched rubber back to its point.

There's no linear travel through space; it actually bends space and time and follows space as it retracts.

In the first mode of travel - around the surface of a planet - they essentially balance on the gravitational field that the generators put out, and they ride a "wave", like a cork does in the ocean. In that mode they're very unstable and are affected by the weather. In the other mode of travel - where they can travel vast distances - they can't really do that in a strong gravitational field like Earth, because to do that, first of all, they need to tilt on their side, usually out in space, then they can focus on the point they need to with the gravity generators and move on. If you can picture space as a fabric, and the speed of light is your limit, it'll take you so long , even at the speed of light, to get from point A to point B. You can't exceed it - not in this universe anyway. Should there be other parallel universes, maybe the laws are different, but anyone that's here has to abide by those rules. The fact is that gravity distorts time and space. Imagining that you're in a spacecraft that can exert a tremendous gravitational field by itself, you could sit in any particular place, turn on the gravity generator, and actually warp space and time and "fold" it. By shutting that off, you'd click back and you'd be at a tremendous distance from where you were, but time wouldn't have even moved, because you essentially shut it off. It' s so farfetched. It's difficult for people to grasp, and as stubborn as the scientific community is, they'll never buy it that this is in fact what happens.


According to Lazar, the propulsion system he worked on at S-4 gives rise to certain peculiar effects, including INVISIBILITY of the craft: "You can be looking straight up at it, and if the gravity generators are in the proper configuration you'd just see the sky above it - you won't see the craft there. That's how there can be a group of people and only some people can be right under it and see it. It just depends how the field is bent. It's also the reason why the crafts appear as if they're making 90- degree turns at some incredible speed; it's just the time and space distortion that you're seeing. You're not seeing the actual event happening."


If the crafts look like they're flying at seven thousand miles per hour and they make a right-angled turn, it's not necessarily what they're doing. They can APPEAR that way because of the gravitational distortion. I guess a good analogy is that you're always looking at a mirage - [it's only when] the craft is shut off and sitting on the ground, THAT'S what it looks like. Otherwise, you're just looking at a tremendously distorted thing, and it will appear like it is changing shape, stopping or going, and it could be flying almost like an airplane, but it would never look that way to you.

"How close do you think you have to get before time distortion takes place?" I asked.

It's tough to say, because it depends on the configuration of the craft. If the craft is hovering in the air, and the gravity amplifiers are focused down to the ground and it's standing on its gravity wave, you would have to get into that focused area. If you're directly underneath the craft at any time there's a tremendous time distortion, and that's in proportion to the proximity of the craft.

September 22, 1990: "Ufos and the Alien Presence" by Michael Lindemann.

Published July 1991. Available from the 2020 Group, 3463 State Street, Box 264, Santa Barbara, CA 93105. Very good Lazar interview, as well as good interviews with Stanton Friedman, Linda Moulton Howe and Budd Hopkins.

Lazar: I don't know if I mentioned it before, but the amplifiers always run at 100%. They are always outputting a maximum gravity wave, and that wave is phase-shifted from zero to 180 degrees. That's essentially the attraction and repulsion, and it's normally at a null setting somewhere in between. It's a very straight-forward system. It looks more like a coal fired engine than very hi-tech.

Mid 1991: "The Lazar Tape", 40 minute VHS videotape

This tape, produced by Lazar is his "official" statement in the matter, done in a science lesson format. Although a little amateurish, it is still full of information and very worthwhile. Supposedly, there is a new version in the works, with full production values. Release date of this new version is unknown.

"The Lazar Tape" is available from Tri-Dot Productions, 1324 S. Eastern, Las Vegas, NV, 89104 for $29.95 + $3.50 shipping.

The following are excerpts:

...And there are two specific different types of Gravity: Gravity A and Gravity B. Gravity A works on a smaller, micro scale while Gravity B works on a larger, macro scale.

We are familiar with Gravity B. It is the big gravity wave that holds the Earth, as well as the rest of the planets, in orbit around the Sun and holds the moon, as well as man-made satellites, in orbit around the Earth. We are not familiar with Gravity A. It is the small gravity wave which is the major contributory force that holds together the mass that makes up all protons and neutrons. Gravity A is what is currently being labeled as the Strong Nuclear Force in mainstream physics, and Gravity A is the wave that you need to access and amplify to enable you to cause space-time distortion for interstellar travel..

To keep them straight, just remember that Gravity A works on an atomic scale, and Gravity B is the big gravity wave that works on a stellar or planetary level. However, don't mistake the size of these waves for their strength, because Gravity A is a much stronger force than Gravity B. You can momentarily break the Gravity B field of the Earth simply by jumping in the air, so this is not an intense gravitational field.

Locating Gravity A is no problem because it is found in the nucleus of every atom of all matter here on Earth, and all matter everywhere else in our universe. However accessing Gravity A with the naturally occurring elements found on Earth is a big problem. Actually, I'm not aware of any way of accessing the Gravity A wave using any Earth element, whether naturally occurring or synthesized, and here's why.

We've already learned that Gravity A is the major force that holds together the mass that makes up protons and neutrons. This means the Gravity A wave we are trying to access is virtually inaccessible as it is located within matter, or at least the matter we have here on Earth.


The most important attribute of these heavier stable elements is that the Gravity A wave is so abundant that it actually extends past the perimeter of the atom. These heavier, stable elements literally have their own Gravity A field around them in addition to the Gravity B field that is native to all elements.

No naturally occurring atoms on Earth have enough protons and neutrons for the cumulative Gravity A wave to extend past the perimeter of the atom so you can access it. Even though the distance the Gravity A wave extends is infinitesimal, it IS accessible and has amplitude, wavelength and frequency just like any other wave in the electromagnetic spectrum. Once you can access the Gravity A wave, you can amplify it just like we amplify any other electromagnetic wave.


So, back to our power source. Inside the reactor, element 115 is bombarded with a proton which plugs into the nucleus of the 115 atom and becomes element 116 which immediately decays and releases or radiates small amounts of antimatter. The antimatter is released in a vacuum into a tuned tube which keeps it from reacting with the matter that surrounds it. It is then directed toward the gaseous matter target at the end of the tube. The matter and antimatter collide and annihilate, totally converting to energy. The heat from this reaction is converted into electrical energy in a near 100% efficient thermoelectric generator. This is a device that converts heat directly into electrical energy. Many of our satellites and space probes use thermoelectric generators, but their efficiency is very, very low.

All of these actions and reactions inside of the reactor are orchestrated perfectly like a tiny little ballet, and in this manner the reactor provides an enormous amount of power.

So, back to our original question: What is the power source that provides the power required for this type of travel? The power source is a reactor which uses element 115 as a fuel, and uses a total annihilation reaction to provide the heat which it converts to energy, making it a compact, lightweight, efficient, onboard power source.

I've got a couple of quick comments on element 115 for those of you that are interested. By virtue of the way it's used in the reactor, it depletes very slowly, and only 223 grams of 115, which is just under 1/2 a pound, can be utilized for a period of twenty to thirty years.

Element 115's melting point is 1740 C.

I need to state here that even though I had hands-on experience with element 115, I didn't melt any of it down and I didn't use any of it for twenty to thirty years to see if it depleted.


Now when a disk travels near another source of gravity, such as a planet or moon, it doesn't use the same mode of travel that we learned about in our science lesson. When a disk is near another source of gravity, like Earth, the Gravity A wave which propagates outward from the disk is phase-shifted into the Gravity B wave which propagates outward from the Earth, and this creates lift. The gravity amplifiers of the disk can be focused independently and they are pulsed and do not stay on continuously.

When all three of these amplifiers are being used for travel, they are in the delta configuration, and when only one is being used for travel it is in the omicron configuration.

As the intensity of the gravitational field around the disk increases, the distortion of space-time around the disk also increases. And if you could see the space-time distortion, this is how it would look....

[Draws a side-view picture of saucer hovering above ground, with field surrounding it and running straight down to the ground. Picture a disk on the end of a pole, then throw a sheet over it.]

As you can see, as the output of the gravitational amplifiers becomes more intense, the form of space-time around the disk not only bends upward, but at maximum distortion actually folds over into almost a heart shape around the top of the disk.

Now remember, this space-time distortion is taking place 360 degrees around the disk, so if you were looking at the disk from the top, the space-time distortion would be in the shape of a doughnut. When the gravitational field around the disk is so intense, that the space-time distortion around the disk achieves maximum distortion and is folded up into this heart shaped form, the disk can't be seen from any vantage point, and for all practical purposes is invisible. All you could see would be the sky surrounding it.

May 1, 1993: "Bob Lazar at The Ultimate UFO Seminar" at Rachel, Nevada

A complete 27 page transcript is available for $8 + $2 shipping ($5 overseas) from Glen Campbell, HCR Box 38, Rachel NV 89001


I'm interested in a little bit more about the physics of the power generation from the development of the anti-matter to the Gravity "A" wave and the amplification and the process of generation of that and being able to fold space.


Well, it's... I can give you, I guess, a brief overview of essentially how that works. If you want an in-depth description, you can give me your address and I can send you a paper on it. Essentially, what the reactor does is provide electrical power and the base gravity wave to amplify, and it does that by interacting matter and antimatter, essentially. The way it does that is injecting an accelerated proton into a piece of 115. That spontaneously generates anti-hydrogen, essentially. That's reacted in a small area. It's a compressed gas, probably compressed atmospheric gas, and the antimatter reacting with matter produces the energy, mainly heat energy, and that is converted into electrical energy by a thermionic generator that appeared to be 100% efficient, which is a difficult concept to believe anyway. Also, the reactor has two functions. That's one of them; the other function is, it provides the basic gravity wave that's amplified, and that appears at the upper sphere of the amplifier itself, and that's tapped off with a waveguide, similar to microwaves, and is amplified and focused, essentially.


So how is the electrical energy related to the amplification of the gravitational "A" wave energy?


The electrical energy is transmitted essentially without wires, and I related it to almost a Tesla setup. It seemed like each sub component on the craft was attuned to the frequency that the reactor was operating at, so essentially the amplifiers themselves received the electrical energy, like a Tesla coil transmits power to a fluorescent tube, and what was the rest of the question?


Yeah, in other words, what is the relationship between... I think you basically answered it.


Yeah, that's how the amplifiers receive the power and through the waveguide to receive the basic wave. It's almost...It's very, very similar to a microwave amplifier...


Was the local means of propulsion the same as this across-space distances? What was the local means of propulsion?


The local means of propulsion is essentially them balancing on a out of phase gravity wave, and it's not as stable as you would think. When the craft took off, it wobbled to some degree. I mean a modern day Hawker Harrier or something along those lines of vertical takeoff craft is much more stable than then in the omicrom configuration, which is that mode of travel. The delta configuration is where they use the three amplifiers. Those are the only two methods I know about for moving the craft.


When you listen to some abduction reports, whether or not people believe it or not, there seems to be a common thread of people being hit by blue beams of light....


Any of the three gravity amplifiers could do that, could lift something off the ground, or for that matter compact it into the ground. That's not a problem, because the craft can operate on one amplifier, in omicron mode, hovering. That would leave the other three (?) amplifiers free to do anything. So I imagine they could pick up cows or whatever else they want to do. On the craft I worked on there was absolutely no provision for anything to come in through the bottom of the craft, or anything along those lines...


So what was the course of energy? How did it go from one area to another area?


The best guess is essentially it operated like a Tesla coil does. A transmitter and essentially a receiver tuned to the transmitting frequency and receives electrical power. There again, that's not real advanced technology. Tesla did that in the 30s, I think.


You mentioned the photon earlier. Do you think that physics is taking a wrong turn by looking for exchange particles, when you're talking about the strong force of gravity again? I'm not clear why you're skeptical about the graviton?


About the graviton?


Every other force seems to have exchange particles connected with it.


No, not necessarily. I mean, they make it have one, but as time goes on, that really hasn't held true. The bottom line is, they don't...First of all, they don't even believe there's a graviton anymore, so I'm not the only one. As far as exchange particles, still, though some of them like the zeta particle, maybe that's an actual thing, but when they're looking at transfers of energy, I think these are scapegoats for the most part. A lot of experiments that I was doing at Los Alamos essentially was along these same lines, but other exchange particles like the intermediate vector bozon, I don't believe that thing exists. I really don't. I think they're grabbing at straws and just coming up with excuses.


What about the small gravity, the Gravity "A"; how can you detect that one? What is the frequency of that?


Well, the frequency that the actual reactor operates at is like 7.46 Hertz. It's a very low frequency.


That's the frequency of Earth's gravity, or universally, all gravity?


That's the frequency the reactor operates at.


I can understand a reactor functioning - theoretically I can understand a reactor functioning at, say, (unintelligible word) 7.46 Hertz. There's a waveguide involved. I don't buy 7.46...


No, that's the basic... The frequency of the gravity wave that's produced, it has to be higher frequency, because you're in a microwave range to follow a conduit like that.


I understand from Lear's lecture that it had a tendency to conduct on the outside also of the reactor.


Right. Well, that's all... this was the electric field we were talking about. The basic frequency, I think, was the way the reactor's operating. The pulses that we detected out of it were probably, instead of a straight DC power supply, it was more along the lines of a pulse, as if we were getting a burst of particles coming out: An antimatter emission, then a reaction, a pulse of energy, and that would repeat. That's about seven and a half Hertz, something along those lines.


Bob, the microwave frequency going to the waveguide is electromagnetic, or that's gravitational?


They're one in the same.


I don't understand what you mean by that.


Gravity is... Unfortunately, physics hasn't gotten to that part yet, but gravity essentially is part of the electromagnetic spectrum.


Then what frequency is it?


That's something I'm reserving for myself.


Something about the microwave range?


Something about the microwave range. Well, you can sort of figure it out by the dimensions of the waveguide itself, and that's about it.


Positive energy versus regular photon?


No, it's not photon.


Electromagnetic Energy?


Right. I'm not trying to be secret, but this is part of the equipment that I'm working on, and I want to get it operating before...


I hope we'll find out one day



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